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(bright orchestral music)
(projector clicking)
(Madonna mimicking bomb exploding)
(Madonna screeching) - Ooh, ooh.
(Dan sighs)
(static crackles)
- We'll breathe deep.
- Yeah.
- 'Cause you have to breathe deep
before you do anything.
(static crackles)
(upbeat rock music)
(soft piano music)
- [Narrator] On August 16, 1958,
Silvio Ciccone drove his wife Madonna
to Mercy Hospital in Bay City, Michigan
to give birth to their first daughter,
a child who would be named after her mother,
and who would become one of the biggest stars
in entertainment that the world has ever known.
Madonna was raised in this ranch home in Pontiac, Michigan.
The Ciccones already had two children
before Madonna arrived, and they would have
two more children after her.
(bright music)
Madonna's mother became seriously ill,
and spending time with her children became more
and more of a struggle
until she eventually passed away.
Madonna was just five years old.
(somber piano music)
Raising five children on his own wasn't easy for Silvio.
While he was at work, Madonna and her siblings spent a lot
of time at this Bay City home of their grandmother
and at this very park directly across the street.
When Madonna was an adolescent, the family moved
to a more affluent neighborhood in Rochester, Michigan.
It was here in this building on Main Street that Madonna,
as an early teen, entered ballet school.
(soft piano music)
The teacher, Christopher Flynn, took a liking to Madonna
and they developed a friendship.
He mentored her and taught her about art and culture
outside of suburban Michigan.
He also convinced her that she was special
and that she was beautiful, words she wasn't used to,
and words that she needed to hear.
(upbeat funk music)
Christopher became a dance teacher
at the University of Michigan and convinced Madonna
to apply for a scholarship.
It was here that Madonna met a graduate dance student
named Peter Kentes.
- The dance program at the University of Michigan
at the time was a conservatory approach.
There were only about 50 dance majors total
between undergraduates and graduates.
The first time I actually saw her was in the dance lounge
where the dancers would hang out between classes.
What stood out to me was the fact that there she was.
Everyone else was sort of sitting around relaxing
and she was workin' hard.
- [Narrator] For his graduating thesis project,
Peter included his new friend Madonna in the choreography.
- Madonna's character was very specific.
Her character was based on the customers
that came into this liquor store late at night.
So, she was able to take that as a theme and develop that.
Sorta spicy, sort of very similar to her own personality.
I think it was easier for her to get in character,
and she added spice to the dance.
The pictures I took a few weeks
before the show one afternoon,
and I did all the dancers at different times,
but the one photo that Madonna maybe wasn't happiest about
was where she's bending over looking between her legs,
but I think the reason is because during her solo
I accidentally let that one stay up
on the wall a little bit too long.
- [Narrator] Peter was very into astrology
and predictions based upon birth dates
and how the moon, sun, and stars are aligned.
- [Peter Reenactor] These two.
- Yeah, I was a self taught astrologer.
I have maybe 30 or 40 books that I purchased
and read and studied.
One of the things I enjoyed doing
was doing charts for people, birth charts.
I was never a person that sort of like read my horoscope
and not go out that day, but when I did Madonna's chart,
- And you can see the full-- - and I had done maybe
over a hundred readings for friends up to this time,
but this was the first one where the reading,
everything sort of came out
she was gonna be rich and famous.
- It's gonna be such a crazy ride for you.
- Here I was looking at a skinny 18 year-old
with bruised up legs and red plastic shoes,
and there couldn't have been a more unlikely candidate
to be rich and famous than Madonna when she was 18.
Except in her mind, I think that was her plan all along
because she didn't seem surprised when I told her.
- [Peter Reenactor] I've never seen it do that.
- I hadn't heard from Madonna for a few months.
School had started, and she had not enrolled.
I got a call saying she needed a ride to the airport
and I said, yeah, sure.
And I went, picked her up.
She had her little doll under her arm,
a little backpack, and a suitcase,
and Christopher, her ballet teacher, was there as well.
We piled in the car, and we took her to the Metro Airport,
Detroit Metro Airport and dropped her off.
She was ready to leave.
She was ready to move on.
She wanted to go.
She wanted to go to New York.
She was excited to be going.
It was a little trepidatious
because it's such a scary thing.
(upbeat disco music)
- [Narrator] Immediately upon arrival,
Madonna began taking dance classes with Pearl Lang
and other notable teachers.
She was prepared to do whatever it took
to become a professional dancer.
- I met Madonna.
I had a lot of friends over the years who were dancers.
Yeah, dancers, actors, musicians.
I had a really good friend named Michael who was a dancer,
and he was studying with someone named Pearl Lang,
who was an avant garde dancer.
So, I was invited to a party, and people were dancing
on the living room floor, and I noticed this woman
who was dancing, spinning in the middle of the floor,
and it looked as though she was dancing in a ring of fire,
and everyone was moving around her.
I had a sense that she was somebody
who was gonna do something in the world.
She kinda came up to me and said, "Oh, nice arms.
"You kinda look like Brando a little bit."
That was kind of her lead in.
So, I got the sense that that might go somewhere.
(phone ringing)
She called me up the next day.
She was over at Michael's house.
They had-- - Hello?
- It seemed like they had a thing going,
but she called me up from his house
and said, "Get your gorgeous Brando body over here,"
which was a nice, definitely a nice come on.
- Well, good morning.
- [Madonna] Yeah, so are you coming or not?
- I said, why don't you guys come over here?
I don't know why I suggested they come to my place.
- All right, so I'll see you--
- Bye. (dial tone humming)
- But it didn't really go any further than that.
She had to go to dance class.
I got the feeling that she was very committed to dancing.
Seemed like she was always off going somewhere,
had something to do with dancing or performance.
Working really, really hard, almost like obsessively hard,
and I know she was doing the modeling.
I know she was waitressing a little bit,
but I got the feeling that she didn't have a lot of money.
(soft music)
- Oh God, I don't wanna be this.
- Yeah, but then you say - Why would you want this?
- to yourself, man, look at what I can do,
that other people, they wouldn't think of doin'.
- I mean, I guess, but-- - I know, I know part of it
has to do with your head, right?
I know that it's true, but other people
wouldn't think of doing the stuff that I do or you.
- Well, of course not, but people always look at,
they always look at you before they look at what you do.
(Dan grunts)
(soft synthesizer music)
- [Narrator] To make ends meet, Madonna began working
as a model for nude photography classes
at The New School and other locations in New York City.
- My first session with Madonna was in 1979 in February,
and I think, if I recall, I had spoken
to the model registrar, and I said look,
can you send me a girl who really has a really nice body?
And that's how I got Madonna to come to class,
and I was very pleased, obviously.
To me, she was very beautiful and pretty
and had a fantastic body, and that's the first time.
I always said, look, for the guys,
get your dick out of your brain or something.
This is not about sex, it's about sculpture.
It's about a body.
It's about what you can show with it.
And then I put the model in different positions
to accentuate form.
My photographs were very sculptural,
there was nothing about sex in them.
That's how I see it.
I didn't get the impression she enjoyed it, necessarily.
It was something to do to make some money.
It's just here I am.
I'm naked, I'm nude.
Take your pictures of me, and let me outta here
and get me paid, (chuckles) you know?
- We liked to hang out on the Upper West Side,
like up near Grant's Tomb, areas like that.
There were Corinthian columns,
buildings that had classical Greco-Roman architecture.
We liked each other a lot, and we were attracted
to each other, but I don't know if there was
any potential for a long term deeper thing.
So, we basically drifted apart
over the period of about three months we were together.
I hadn't seen her for several months,
and I bumped into her on 34th Street.
- N.B.!
Norris!
- And, just bumped into her on the street,
and I say, hey, how ya doin', Madonna?
Nice to see you.
And she was really warm and affectionate,
and we talked a little bit.
- I quit dancing.
- Wait, what?
What do you mean, you quit?
I thought that was the whole reason you came here.
- She said, "Well, ya know, I just felt like
"it wasn't going anywhere.
"Also, I felt like my body was hurting,"
and I realized that, she realized
that this would be her life.
- So, now what?
Now what are you gonna do?
- Maybe acting or music?
- So, I invited her to this party.
I said I think you might meet some fun people there,
some interesting, there's gonna be a lot of artists,
musicians, colorful, your type of people.
I think you might dig, you might enjoy the scene.
So, she said, "Yeah, sure, I'll be there."
(party guests chattering) (upbeat funk music)
Lo and behold, she was.
- I first met Madonna at a party
given by my friend Norris Burroughs.
She seemed to be,
looked like she felt out of place at the party.
- I met Dan at a hand painted T-shirt company
called the Lotus Shop,
and it was Saint Mark's Place in the East Village.
I kind of gravitated towards Dan
because we were both musicians as well as artists,
and we had a similar sort of sense of humor,
and we both kind of like were attracted
to the same women, which was an interesting,
something that manifested over the years
with interesting results.
(party guests chattering) - I mean, yes.
I mean, I am doing what you asked,
and you're socializing?
- As beautiful as she was, that kind of thing
didn't exactly, ya know, gee, I gotta go hang out,
'cause it looked like she didn't,
was not really enjoying herself all that much.
I could even be wrong.
Maybe that was just her way.
- I wasn't sure if anyone...
- Sorry, this stupid clasp keeps--
- I don't remember exactly what the issue was.
It was either a broken clasp or a button or something,
but she asked for assistance,
and whatever it was that needed doing,
I helped her with it.
- Thanks.
(soft rock music)
(party guests chattering)
Well?
Aren't you going to kiss me?
- It actually, it felt a little like a scene
from a movie to me, because ya know,
"Aren't you gonna kiss me?"
Have I heard that in a, I'm not sure.
I did kiss her, though.
It wasn't a long kiss.
I mean, it was, 'cause I had just met her
and she was so beautiful.
- I knew he was gonna be there,
but I wasn't really thinking along those lines,
but when I first saw them together,
I noticed that there was an attraction between them.
So, it seemed inevitable in the moment.
(bright music)
(Madonna giggles)
- We left together, we left the party together,
and walked around.
We walked around the place, around Manhattan,
for about an hour or so.
(thunder rumbles)
And then I said goodbye to her at wherever she was headed.
I think it was a stairway, and there was
a little romantic interplay,
and she went off down the hallway.
She was very assertive, though, a very assertive person,
and it made me certainly wanna see her again,
and I think a few days later, we had our first date.
(soft upbeat rock music)
We took a bus ride up to The Cloisters.
I met her at the bus.
We were the only ones on the bus,
so, I took a bunch of pictures on the way up there.
And then the bus filled in a little while later.
We took some more pictures and some kids were gawkin'
at what's goin' on, and she had 'em come back
and pose for a picture.
This is the first time I was ever with her,
and she was doin' all kinds of antics on the seat,
the back of the thing,
lying on the back of the seat with her head down,
just posin' for pictures.
I had a camera, and she was right there
posing for the pictures. (chuckles)
I think I had been to The Cloisters in grade school
as like a trip, like some kind of field trip.
The Cloisters was a convent that was brought over,
every stone was brought over and rebuilt.
- Well, everybody had long hair in Jerusalem
when Jesus Christ was young.
They all must have looked sort of androgynous, right?
- Yeah. - 'Cause they had on
those long robes on and stuff.
- Yeah. - Right?
- Yeah, except the men all had beards.
- Oh yeah.
When do you think the guy first shaved,
the first guy shaved?
- I'm sure they trimmed their beard with rocks.
The first guy that shaved, it couldn't have been
a very close shave with a rock.
- Wonder why he started to do it.
Bet ya guy got a zit and he needed to squeeze it out.
- Or-- - Shaved it off.
- A bat got caught in it.
- Or a mouse?
- Yeah, a creature. - But how come--
- Everyone said it looks pretty good.
- But how-- - This is good.
- How come rats are ugly and mouses aren't?
- It's the scale.
(train rattling) (soft synthesizer music)
- [Narrator] Dan was living in Corona Queens
with his brother in an abandoned former synagogue.
- Some friends of mine from graduate school
found this old synagogue in Queens,
and they poured a new floor and put in electricity.
It had been abandoned for 15 years.
And one guy left, somebody got married,
and they asked me to move in, so, I did.
- [Narrator] Dan invited Madonna over to the synagogue
where they would spend more and more time
getting to know each other.
It was here that Madonna would begin her journey into music.
- Danny and Madonna were seeing each other.
This is probably the beginning, I'm thinkin' '78.
They met at a May Day party,
probably with, I think it was Norris Burroughs's party.
So, they hit it off.
They started seeing each other,
and she would come over and stay.
So, that's how I met her over here in the synagogue.
(bright synthesizer music)
(Dan mumbles)
This is the way we got in.
Even though there's a gate in the front,
back in those days that gate was kaput.
So, we had to come in this way.
It's a wonderful neighborhood, you'll love it.
No. (laughs)
So, come on in.
This is the studio where we rehearsed,
we played, we jammed.
This is, you know, the general living space
where everybody kind of would congregate.
By everyone, I mean me, Dan, and Madonna,
and then we'd, you know, play around.
Here are the drums.
These are the drums Madonna played.
Danny played 'em.
Mike Monahan played 'em.
They're still here.
(playful drum music)
She used to put her gum,
she used to put her gum on this post here,
and there's still little pieces of gum there. (chuckles)
- You walked in and saw everything.
There were guitars here, there was a bass over here,
and a whole set of drums.
(soft music)
I don't think she thought I'm gonna be a drummer,
but there's a guy playing guitar,
and here we're playin' music.
(drumsticks tapping)
- I think drums was the instrument that Danny first,
you know, showed her stuff to do.
- As a dancer, she was always into counting, ya know,
everything, eight counts, and it fit right into drumming,
so it was a very smooth transition from dancing to drumming.
And after just goin' through a few little,
she picked up on it pretty easily, ya know?
- And then, you know, it would just be,
if someone's playin' drums you'd start playin' along
with them, and then there was jamming that would happen.
(plodding drum music)
So, she would be playing drums,
and learning how to play drums all day long.
(somber music)
(Dan mimicking drumsticks tapping)
And then the feet.
She's got the feet in there opposite the snare,
and away we went.
- [Narrator] At the time, Dan Gilroy and his brother, Ed,
were performing as a two man musical act called Bill and Gil
in a variety show in New York City called Voidville.
- Bill and Gil was a two man performance.
We used guitars.
We used percussion.
(soft rock music)
That's how Bill and Gil started.
Ed and I had a performance at Voidville,
a theater in New City on 2nd Avenue,
and Madonna, she came over to the synagogue
and came to the show.
There's a photo of her making herself up in the bathroom
with that pink and black tight leotard kind of thing,
but that was just before we were going to do Voidville,
but she wasn't living here at the time.
(camera clicks)
- So,
there ya go.
- She looked fantastic in this leotard.
I took a bunch of pictures.
I think she had red shoes on, red shoes with high heels.
Anyway, I took a bunch of pictures of that.
In fact, I asked her to come upstairs at the synagogue
because the space was big.
Pictures looked really great with
that shocking pink right in the middle
of this gray brown synagogue.
- [Narrator] A recording artist named Patrick Hernandez
was interested in having Madonna
be part of his show in Paris.
His song, Born to Be Alive, was a tremendous hit,
and his team offered Madonna visions of her own stardom
if she would come with them to France.
- She looked like a perfect punk,
like that ideal, (chuckles) right?
That's why they brought her over there.
He was gonna release Disco Queen, and she was like,
ya know, that thing they were thinking about.
(soft orchestral music)
- She goes to France with the Patrick Hernandez show
over the course of that summer.
- [Madonna] Dear Dan, I was crazy to put four letters
in the mail at once.
I'm sure it makes a person feel popular,
but after all, you are very lovable,
and I'm not such a heartless fiend,
although I'm sure I appear that way to many people.
I have a lot of leisure time now, much to my frustration.
I can't stand the thought of doing absolutely nothing.
It's a nightmare to think about it.
I'm so full of anxiousness and ambition,
and I long for some responsibility, some hard work,
and certainly some sweat.
Those are the things that make me feel real,
besides you, of course.
- She wanted to create stuff,
but I'm not sure she knew exactly what vehicle to use.
- [Madonna] This is my last stay in Paris,
and I wonder if the sky will always be so gray.
I long to put my arms around you, and to kiss you,
and hold you really close.
Au revoir, mon cherie.
- So, the Patrick Hernandez thing, for her,
I guess ended at the end of the summer,
or in the beginning of autumn,
and so she came back to New York.
(soft rock music)
- I and my sort would struggle against tradition,
try at least to displace old cants with new ones.
I thought I was right about life at various times,
but faith is difficult.
- [Narrator] Dan and Madonna resume their relationship
right where it left off.
Soon after, they decided to live together.
- And she would stay over here,
they'd stay over there, stay over here,
and then it just kind of gradually she wants,
I'd like her to stay here, he said so.
You know, we had 3,400 square feet of living space,
and we only had one kitchen and one bathroom.
So, we had to kinda work on that.
Over here's the sink.
Good old New York sink, the original, one and only.
Madonna made a lot of popcorn here, I could tell ya that.
There was always the smell of popcorn in the house.
Either Parmesan cheese on it or paprika
or there was pepper or something like that.
She loved popcorn.
This was a tough town, New York, back in the '70s.
She didn't have a place to say after awhile.
So, it was just, seemed to be
the right thing to do, ya know.
- My rat's dead?
- Nah, (speaking in foreign language).
- Sounds very French Japanese.
(speaking in foreign language)
French Japanese French, eh?
- There's one thing I don't,
there's one thing I,
there's one thing I, there's one thing
I don't like. - I just can't even
quite get around to talking about it.
- One thing I don't really like, there's one thing I...
- But hey, ya know, I'll tell ya one thing.
- Did you ever-- - You know, we're patient.
- Patient? - Yeah.
Yeah, I don't know if I ever did, I'm not sure, but...
- Well, I don't know why a patient could be patient.
- Wonder.
Well, listen, number one, wondering is very good,
and I'm glad you've been wondering.
(upbeat music)
- I remember after she came back from Europe,
she called me and I went to meet her.
They were shooting that film A Certain Sacrifice.
- [Narrator] Madonna was also scouring the help wanted ads
in the acting and talent trade magazines.
And with that, she landed a role in the student film.
- I put an ad in Backstage Magazine, is it?
And I believe it said something like I'm looking for
a dominatrix with dark hair who can dance and act.
I was sort of irritated by the kind of people I was finding,
and then I was going through all this stuff,
and I was throwing things out, and something
that I had missed was Madonna's letter that she wrote to me,
and a picture of her dropped out of this envelope,
and she was just putting lipstick on,
and it was an incredibly sexy picture,
and I was like, I don't really have to look any further.
And then of course she wrote this three page letter,
which is pretty amazing.
It was kind of a history of her life
up to that point in time.
At the end of the letter, she put a little tiny thing
in little type, is that all?
And it was very cute.
So, the year and month that I started filming
A Certain Sacrifice was September of 1979,
and the first scene was the fountain scene
where Madonna is dancing with Dasheil, the protagonist,
and as I was filming it, I was filming it by myself,
no sound man, no camera man, it was just me and them,
so the three of us, and I was sort of dancing
in the fountain with them trying to keep
the water off of my camera, but that was all improvised.
So, basically just here's what's gonna happen,
and they just go for it.
That, to me, was the magic of making this movie.
There was a lot of direction.
There was, the same time, who she was
created partly what the movie was.
She was very beautiful back then.
I still think she's beautiful.
- I told them that I was in love with you.
(bell ringing)
- And what'd they say?
- They were heartless and,
and then they were really jealous, just jealous.
- If there were lines to rehearse,
she always had them rehearsed.
She always was on time, and even though this movie,
and she knew it, was not a professional production,
she was going to put the best into it that she could,
and she did every time.
(suspenseful music)
- That film is just really (chuckles) bizarre.
I don't think I would have wanted
to have anything to do with that movie,
with all due respect to the director.
(Madonna screams)
- It depends on how you look at this movie.
If you're looking at it as if you're gonna look
at a Hollywood production,
you are gonna be really disappointed.
If you look at it as street life in New York in the '70s,
I think it's great.
Obviously there's a lot of amateur stuff in it,
but when it gets it right, it's really, it's fun.
- You can make the effort, you can have the desire,
but it's not enough.
Need something more.
(upbeat drum music)
- [Narrator] All the while, Madonna kept up
with her drumming practice, and she was soon ready
to take on the challenge of learning another instrument.
- She already could keep the beat.
So, naturally, she wanted to get more into music
than just drumming, not that drumming isn't music.
Well, people say, oh, you taught Madonna how to play guitar.
Actually, it's like riding a bicycle.
No one actually teaches you.
They hold your head, and at some point
you learn yourself, right?
(upbeat rock music)
- [Narrator] Madonna's friend Angie,
who had a small role in A Certain Sacrifice,
was a bass guitar player, and Madonna thought
she should introduce her to the Gilroys as well.
- Angie was kind of tall, stately.
She was a ballet dancer, gorgeous big beautiful lips.
You'd just be quite taken with her, and Madonna was.
- Dan and I were between bands at the time,
and Madonna was playing, and the three of us
were kind of just, ya know, playing around here,
and Dan and I had a bunch of songs, too.
And so Madonna asked Angie to come over,
'cause Angie had a bass.
So, Angie came over, and that's how
the first Breakfast Club started.
We had Madonna on drums, Angie on bass,
and Dan and me out front with the guitars.
(upbeat punk rock music)
The material we did was stuff that Dan and I
had already, a lot of it was stuff
that was already in the mix.
We did songs like Curtis Come Back.
¶ Curtis come back ¶
¶ We want you over on our side. ¶
- That was a good song.
Madonna on drums on Curtis Come Back, Angie on bass,
Dan and me on guitars.
- It kinda felt like it was gonna be the sort of band where,
like a Fleetwood Mac thing where you'd have
Lindsey Buckingham and Stevie Nicks and Christine McVie
taking turns on vocals, or they would harmonize.
- We did a song called Trouble, which she was out front,
and the three of us wrote, Dan, Madonna, and I.
¶ Trouble, trouble, trouble, trouble, trouble ¶
¶ Trouble, trouble ¶
- Dan was on drums, Angie and I
were on guitar and bass, Madonna up front.
¶ Trouble, trouble ¶
¶ I've got this trouble in my body ¶
¶ When no love's in my heart ¶
¶ Oh ¶
(somber piano music)
- [Narrator] Angie's days with the band were numbered,
and although fun at first,
she didn't last long in the lineup.
- Angie was great.
I'm a big fan of Angie's, always have been, always will be.
Great person, good woman, strong,
strong fingers playin' the bass.
She was at a little disadvantage, though,
'cause the three of us lived here.
- Knock knock.
- Who's there?
- Olive.
- Olive who?
- Olive you.
- I love olives.
Got any?
- Whoa, that's shootin' ya
in the foot. - You gonna eat that?
- At any given moment, you could just say,
I need to, can we just work on this harmony
for a couple of seconds?
And then that would turn into a half hour, an hour
of working on the material.
And could we just go over this drum part,
and the bass, things like that.
But Angie didn't live here.
- I just feel bad.
- I have mixed feelings about Angie.
I just feel like we were giving her parts
that were too hard, or it could have been
more like Rolling Stones, you know,
like, (mimicking bass guitar music).
- I guess.
- Madonna didn't really wanna work in that foursome anymore,
and with good reason, because she knew it wasn't really like
an act that would go.
There was a little bit of a competition there.
One time Angie said, in front of Madonna, about me,
"I will have him." (laughs)
And Madonna was like, "Oh, go ahead, I don't care."
So, it could have been, that could have been part of it,
you know, who is the audience looking at here?
Man, they're worse than marriages, the bands.
Really, the breakup, 'cause there's so many people involved.
(chuckles) That was the worst.
Anyway, that was the worst, when Angie.
- It just was time for a change, and Gary became available.
- [Narrator] Gary Burke was a childhood friend
of the Gilroys and a former band mate as well.
(soft rock music)
¶ Hasn't it been a long winter ¶
- It was Dan, Ed, myself, and Mike Monahan.
Called ourselves the Acme Band,
which I still think is a great band name.
- So, we had Gary, Mike, Dan, and me comin' over here
and just playing for the fun of it.
It was just really so much fun.
¶ Is all blue ¶
- It wasn't like we had Gary waiting in the wings.
Nothing was happening for a week or so or even more,
but we knew Gary was around, and we wanted to play gigs.
So, I think we just invited Gary over.
- See, I wasn't privy to their discussions,
but all of a sudden, I was invited
to be the bass player. - One, two, three, four.
(upbeat rock music)
¶ I don't have far to go now ¶
¶ But it certainly seems so ¶
¶ With you at the end of the line, dear ¶
¶ I really do wanna go ¶
¶ But this wind, it keeps whippin' in on me, yeah ¶
- So, ¶ The cold wind ¶
- They just said like, do you wanna join the band?
And so I said yeah,
okay, I'm in.
¶ Oh yeah ¶
¶ Sometimes my spirit's empty ¶
¶ And I need to fill it up ¶
¶ I know that there is plenty ¶
¶ But I never get enough ¶
- I was the new bass player.
Angie Smit was out, I felt bad about that.
I had mixed feelings, I don't like, you know,
I don't like all that band,
¶ That keeps whippin' ¶
- that band stuff that goes on when people get replaced
and this and that, you know, hurt feelings and all that.
I'm not comfortable with it.
So, I had mixed feelings, but I kinda had a crush
on Madonna at this point,
even though she was Dan's girlfriend.
¶ Sometimes I try to attract it ¶
- It was the Acme Band, so it was the same four members
plus this intriguing new chick.
(chuckles) Chick.
¶ It keeps whippin' ¶
- It was like people you play ball with or something.
It was like people you knew come on over and we'll play.
¶ Cold wind, it keeps ¶
- We could already play fairly well together.
¶ Oh yeah ¶
- And Madonna was that new component.
¶ It keeps whippin' ¶
¶ It keeps whippin' in on me ¶
- It was a good band.
It was a good punky band.
Madonna would come out from behind the drums
and do her two songs.
¶ Whippin', whippin' ¶
¶ In on me ¶ - She had star quality.
I could see that right away, on night one.
- While we made that change, and brought Gary in,
we also brought in Mike Monahan back again.
- And Mike, who had been in the Acme Band,
he was gonna come back and be on drums again,
and that would free Madonna up to play the organ.
- We got a little keyboard, a Farfisa keyboard,
and Madonna played the keyboard for a while.
- [Narrator] With the band now fully fleshed out,
it was time to start doing some promotion
and getting some work.
- The photo that was taken in the alley here
goin' up the steps, it was just, we decided
we were gonna take some shots to advertise our gigs.
It was like, I think, Gary, he was sticking head out here,
and Dan, Mike, Madonna.
I was up on top, ya know, some silly pose
I'm not thrilled about, and that's where
this place was, right?
(soft synthesizer music)
(band members chattering)
- [Narrator] Madonna and Dan managed to balance
their professional relationship with their personal one,
but Dan wasn't the only band member with eyes for Madonna.
- Hey, Madonna, can I talk to you for a sec?
- [Madonna] Yeah, what's up, bear?
(soft ominous music)
- Did you want something,
but you weren't sure it was the right thing?
I mean, were you ever afraid to just say what you want?
- No.
- So, you know exactly what you want?
- Yes.
- Madonna wanted to be famous.
That was her thing, man.
And she didn't care if she got through it through dance,
through rock and roll, whatever.
She wanted to be famous.
- I will do whatever I have to do to get there.
- She would be so squirrelly, like I wanna be famous.
She wanted to be famous now, man.
Yeah, now.
- It's not funny.
- I know, I'm sorry.
- And she was like, you could just see it.
She was like, in her body language,
it's like, ooh, when's it gonna happen?
That kind of thing.
- What was it that you were talking about wanting?
- [Gary] Nothing, I was just asking...
- Oh, I knew Gary and Mike had a crush on Madonna.
Everyone had a crush on Madonna.
The guy upstairs, John Horne, had a crush on Madonna.
I'm sure Gary and Mike had a crush on Madonna.
She's beautiful, she's in the band,
you're workin' with her every day.
- I did tell Madonna a few times how I felt about her.
I was working in a bookstore.
I told the manager of the bookstore that I was sick.
I went and I took the train and the bus.
(somber piano music)
And I knew she was alone at the synagogue that day.
It's a major betrayal type of thing, though.
You don't do this, 'cause they
hadn't split up yet. (knuckles knocking)
- Hey, bear.
What are you doing here?
I've been working on this new song.
- Wait, Madonna, I came here because
I just had something that I really wanted to tell you.
- I'm sorry, of course, what's wrong?
- I shouldn't be here.
- Gary, just spit it out.
You're starting to freak me out.
- Okay.
Madonna, I don't want anything to come between me and Dan,
but I have feelings.
I just wanted to say it.
This was stupid.
I know you're with Dan, but...
- Do you wanna hear my song still?
- Are you gonna say anything about what I just--
- I don't know what to say to that.
I mean, I'm flattered.
- I think I should go.
I'm sorry, I shouldn't...
- It kinda like shocked her kind of thing.
I shouldn't have done that.
I wanted her to, I wanted to be Chris Stein
to her Debbie Harry, that kind of a thing.
(upbeat rock music)
- She always wanted to do something,
she wanted to be the center of attention,
so, we did a thing where we walked around New York.
We dressed in white, we walked around New York
playing through a little Pignose portable amp
that I was wearing.
We plugged into it with a cable splitter
so we were both playin' out of this one amp,
and she was playin' chords, like these chords.
(light guitar music)
But in rhythm.
(bright guitar music)
Like those All Along the Watchtower chords,
but she did it, was doing it with an open E,
'cause she didn't do the fingering then.
- They would dress all in white.
This was like during the Breakfast Club days,
and they would take their Pignose amps and go in the subway
and sort of busk, but electric instead of acoustic.
I never saw them, though.
They would go off, and they would come back,
and they were both dressed in white
with their Pignose amps. (chuckles)
They'd gone into the city, gone into Manhattan,
and just like played.
I kind of admired them both, 'cause I was too shy
to do that kind of stuff. (chuckles)
- (laughs) So, we'd walk down the street
playin' our little...
(light guitar music)
It might have been the other way.
That was fun, that was so much fun.
- There's a song that Madonna wrote
called Daddy Won't You Please Come Home,
and it's a song that she writes about her father,
and it's just her on guitar and her singing by herself,
and it's a very tender song.
I mean, ya know, she's singin' from this little,
tiny little space in her heart probably,
which is a very tender spot.
¶ Oh, boy, I got a letter today ¶
¶ From my daddy, and here's what he had to say ¶
¶ Baby, won't you please come home ¶
¶ He said, baby won't you please come home ¶
- Then there's a song called Danny's Song,
which Madonna wrote about Danny Gilroy.
It's a beautiful song all about Dan's character,
and what it was like for her to be with him.
It's a very heartfelt song, but it's funny.
It's hilarious, ya know, like,
he doesn't care too much for money.
He leaves it there on the floor.
¶ Daniel likes to run when the sky is blue ¶
¶ And Daniel goes to the rooftop when the day is through ¶
¶ Well, he's watching the fleas in the alley ¶
¶ When the phone rings on the floor ¶
¶ But he doesn't pick it up 'cause he knows who it's for ¶
- I knew the exact moment when I thought she'd be famous.
She was playing guitar, strummin' really big and strong,
and she had really short hair then, combed back.
She looked like Bowie and Elvis to me,
strummin' away, and singin', and here I was
playin' the drums thinkin', hold on.
I think I'm lookin' at somethin' that's gonna,
something's gonna happen here.
(somber rock music)
- The next song is a song which Danny wrote
for Madonna to sing.
It's called Moving Along.
That's the song that we used to do
before we went into Trouble, 'cause this a slower.
(Ed humming)
¶ Movin' along ¶
¶ So move it along ¶
¶ I cannot be late tonight ¶
¶ But you believe in how my feet can fly ¶
¶ I just got to be on time ¶
- The next song here is a song called Simon Says.
This is a great track.
Danny put together a track and played it backwards.
So it's like (mimicking tape vocals rewinding)
and Madonna sang it going forward.
(disjointed upbeat music)
¶ Says Simon here come shine my shoes ¶
¶ And you cry while you do it 'cause you got the blues ¶
¶ You say that your heart's going to break ¶
¶ Maybe soon you will see your mistake ¶
- And it's the first time that Madonna
heard herself on headphones on this one,
and she has one of those moments, ya know,
where it's like everything just hits it,
and there's some kind of a vibration that's comin' outta ya.
Ya don't know where it's comin' from.
This is what she kinda felt, I think,
when she had these headphones on,
'cause shes' goin', wow, it sounds really great in here.
(disjointed upbeat music) ¶ You said ¶
¶ Feel so good now ¶
- Madonna had started writing songs.
So, once Gary and Mike were in there,
she had a song called
¶ Again and again, over and over ¶
¶ Ah ah ah ¶
- Ya know, she was just so cute, ya know?
You could just imagine.
¶ Again and again ¶
And it was a showstopper.
- We played one particular gig.
It was kind of a pop-up place.
It was called Bo's Space and it was
in the West 20s in Manhattan.
And we played a gig that night,
and the crowd really enjoyed it,
but there was a difference between when Madonna came out
and did her two numbers.
The crowd really went wild for those two numbers.
So, I guess that got into Madonna's head like,
hey, maybe I should sing more.
- At the Bo's Space thing, I think that that was maybe
the first time where she, I'm not sure,
but felt like, whoa, there's somethin' happening
with me and my microphone that isn't happening
when I'm behind a keyboard with someone else singing.
(somber music)
And that night in bed, it was, I felt a distance
that I hadn't felt before.
She was thinkin' about maybe she didn't wanna be in a band,
or she wanted to front the band.
- Before you knew it, Madonna and Mike came to me and said,
we're thinking Madonna should,
we think Madonna should do more numbers.
We think we should flip it.
We think Madonna should do eight out of the 10,
and the Gilroys should do two.
- Hey, guys.
Do you have a sec?
We have something that we would like to present to you.
- Okay.
- We were thinking that I could be the lead singer,
that I could be up front most of the time.
- This band has no lead singer,
and why would we make you the lead singer?
- We think that this is going to benefit the band.
- They said, we think what we need to do
is have Madonna be in front doin' her songs,
and us be in the backup band.
- No.
It would change the whole...
I don't know.
Dan, what do you think?
- I don't know.
I mean, these are our songs.
- Exactly.
We're the songwriters.
We're the main parts.
- I've written songs.
- You wrote two songs, Madonna.
You can't do a gig with two songs.
- 'Cause that was sensitive, ya know?
And the Gilroys weren't buyin' it at all.
- We weren't into that.
I didn't wanna be a side person.
- I kinda went along with it, probably once again
'cause I had a stupid crush on Madonna.
It was just like a pipe dream.
- She wanted to be out there.
She wanted her songs to be sung.
- Both sides went to their separate corners,
and we decided to request 50/50.
- What does that mean?
- I mean like 50% of the time I'm up front,
and 50% of the time one of you are up front.
- No, that's not what this band is.
- They said nope.
So that was surprising.
I woulda loved it if they had done that compromise.
I think everyone would have been happy.
- Okay.
Okay, well, then I think that we will start our own band,
and you can be up front all you would like in your band.
Come on guys, let's go.
- Mike and Gary thought that the best way to go
would be go with Madonna.
- So, it hurt a lot, but me, Mike, and Madonna split off.
- To Mike and Gary it was obvious
that this is an act that could happen.
To Ed and I it was like this is
this young upstart in the band.
- Dan, it's gonna be fine.
- For Dan and Madonna, it must have been quiet something
because not only was the band breakin' up,
but this was also the breakup of their being together.
- It's over.
You got what you wanted.
- What I wanted?
What the hell?
Dan, you're my brother, man.
You think I wanted to see you unhappy or something?
- No, Ed, I know.
You liked it better when it was just us living here.
There you go.
Everything's back to normal.
- Once the music breakup happened,
she was livin' at the synagogue with me,
and once the band broke up, it kinda,
it was all a big thing, ya know?
It was all one big thing, and the band breakup
signaled the beginning of everything breakin' up, yeah.
(somber piano music)
I was being brave, is what I was doing.
See, because it was obvious that Madonna
wasn't here permanently.
That was from the word go.
You could see she was kind of,
and you know you grab her for a little while is what it was.
- So, Madonna, Mike, and I went off.
We had to find a place to rehearse and stuff.
So, we ended up at this place called
The Music Building on 38th Street,
a little below Port Authority in Times Square.
Aye.
(soft rock music)
- [Man] Let me see.
- [Narrator] The Music Building was a place
where musicians could lease out rooms
to hold their equipment and to rehearse in.
- Well, The last time I was here was 1982.
So, it's really, really going down memory lane.
It's kinda freakin' me out.
- [Narrator] Madonna, Gary, and Mike couldn't afford
to rent a room on their own,
so they shared it with another band.
- But oh, this looks like the same horn
that Madonna was on a lot.
Always hustling, always hustling. (laughs)
We called ourselves Madonna In The Sky.
There's no mention on the internet of Madonna In The Sky,
but that was our short-lived threesome,
Mike Monahan, myself, and Madonna.
It was the first time she'd ever been the front person
of a band, the total front person.
She was writing her little songs, playing rhythm guitar.
I was on bass and Mike was on the drums.
Songs like Safe Neighborhood.
(frenetic punk music)
¶ I live at the top of the hill ¶
¶ No one keeps me here against my will ¶
¶ I don't need no safe neighborhood ¶
¶ I got to feel good my own way, yeah ¶
- Yep, Madonna was pumpin' out songs.
I was doin' songs, too, but I didn't feel they fit the band.
I had my own singer songwriter thing goin' on.
I was always real super shy about presenting.
They didn't seem to fit, I was scared of rejection.
¶ Still life, 'til the breeze blows it all around ¶
¶ Still listening for a sign ¶
- Did you write that?
- Yeah.
Just a little somethin' I've been workin' on.
- Once in awhile Madonna would overhear a song,
or I would leave a tape around.
- I like it.
Keep working on it.
¶ Still life, at least until the breeze blows it all around ¶
¶ Still listening for a sound ¶
(upbeat rock music)
- Come on, guys, come on.
- Here we go. - Come on.
- She would dress us.
We would go to Saint Mark's Place,
which was like the Bohemian center
of New York City at that time. - Come on.
Come on, now.
- And she'd buy jackets.
Buy purple pants, you're gonna wear these purple pants.
You're gonna wear this red jacket.
Here's a peach colored shirt with a checkerboard pattern,
then she'd do the same for Mike.
So, she was in charge of that, too.
(Madonna laughing)
- Wow, that's...
What?
- I think I was in on
her very first choreography of the band.
She said, "Let's do this song on our knees."
And Mike was like, Mike was on the drums,
so, he didn't have to.
He was like, "Don't do that.
"What are you doing?"
So, we're like just doin' this song, crawling on our knees
while I'm playin' bass and she's playing guitar.
I was all in, like, okay.
You think that works?
Yeah, it's artistic, ya know?
¶ Bam ba boom bomm ¶
Poor Mike, he had a full time job as a,
it was Metropolitan Life Insurance.
So, he'd come from a long day of work,
come to The Music Building to rehearse,
and sometimes the beat would slow down or something,
and Madonna would go, "Mike!"
Ya know, and he'd like.
(soft ominous music)
And then one day he came in, one hot August day,
he came in and said, "I'm done."
- [Madonna] What are you doing?
- I'm lookin' for my other stick.
What does it look like I'm doin'?
- You just need to start being on time.
This is getting ridiculous, Mike.
It's becoming an every night thing with you.
- Screw this.
I'm sorry if I'm not keepin' up with your standards,
but I have a job, I got bills
and you just don't get it. - Mike.
Mike, stop.
Look, you're just tired.
- Yeah, I am.
I'm really frickin' tired.
I'm tired of this whole thing.
I'm tired of this band, and just, it's just everything.
I just can't, I can't do it anymore.
I'm sorry, bear.
I can't.
- So, he quit.
Mike left the band.
So, then there was a period of time
where it was just Madonna and me,
and she was always on the horn tryin' to get guitarists,
tryin' to hire people, find a new drummer.
- [Narrator] Back when Madonna was in college,
she had met a drummer named Stephen Bray.
She got in touch with him, and he decided
to come to New York to join the band.
- Steve knew Madonna from Michigan,
and he came to town, and that changed everything for them.
- He's a drummer.
He's a musician.
He's gonna come to New York.
Okay, good.
So, Stephen Bray came to New York.
(upbeat rock music)
- A lot of that CBGB's thing back then
was anyone can do this.
We just get up and let's do it, but Steve was,
Steve had chops, serious chops.
- I remember the first day he came.
He's kind of amazed, as many people are,
but you could tell he had to like, wow.
I thought Detroit was big, that kind of a thing.
He got into New York right away,
and then he sort of took over the role of arranger,
you know, the leader of the group, sort of.
- [Narrator] And now, this new lineup
needed to find themselves a name.
- How about we just call it Madonna?
- Yeah.
I love it.
- I wanted to call it Madonna
'cause that made perfect sense to me.
- I hate that idea.
- Why not?
It's like rock and roll, man.
You wanna stir things up.
That's what we want.
- I'm not going to be in a band called Madonna.
- That'll piss people off,
people who believe in Jesus's mother or whatever.
It'll piss them off.
How dare she call herself Madonna?
And that was her real name, that's the funny part.
- How about we call ourselves No Name.
(Madonna giggles)
How about that?
- Wait, what's No Name spelled backwards?
Emanon?
How about Emmy for short?
It was actually a nickname I had growing up, too.
- I didn't wanna have that name, Emmy.
- Not bad.
I'll go for that one.
Emmy.
- Okay, so, we'll call it Emmy.
What a name.
What a horrible name for a rock group. (chuckles)
(somber music)
- [Narrator] The Music Building
was not designated for residents,
but with nowhere else to live, eating, sleeping,
and even bathing in the building was Madonna's only option.
- We kinda lived at The Music Building for a while.
Ya know, that's how bad it was.
It was really the salad days.
We were living in the studio.
We didn't have an apartment.
I had one, but I got kicked out of it or whatever.
- [Narrator] But even this little bit of security
would soon be pulled out from under them.
- All of a sudden, we were out of the room.
We were told the other group took over the lease.
You're out, you're out.
It's like, what?
- We're just being kicked out of the room.
That's all I know.
- They can't do that.
We have a lease, don't we?
- I don't know how it happened, even to this day.
- [Narrator] Brian Symms was a guitar player
that was renting a space in another room in the building,
and was not currently committed to any band,
which was perfect timing.
- Let's go talk to him right now.
- We needed a room, Brian was free, he had the talent.
So, that's how we formed that Emmy group.
(upbeat rock music)
¶ Emmy ¶ ¶ Emmy ¶
¶ She'd submit the call ¶
¶ It's so hot behind a wall ¶
¶ But she keeps it in a ball ¶
¶ Emmy ¶ ¶ Emmy ¶
¶ You'll never break inside ¶
¶ But if you wanna try, you won't make it out alive ¶
¶ Emmy ¶ ¶ Emmy ¶
¶ She'll slay you with a glance, put you in a trance ¶
¶ Are you sure you wanna dance with Emmy ¶
¶ Emmy ¶
¶ She's gonna steal your heart ¶
¶ And she wants to know that you want hers ¶
- She was churnin' out the songs,
but Steve would arrange them, so she'd come up
with the chords and the words.
Steve would write a rhythm.
I would come up with the bass part
or Steve would suggest a bass part, same with Brian.
He would come up with his own guitar part,
- I gotcha. - or Steve would say
try this and that.
So, he was sorta the arranger
- I got it. - at that point.
We were gettin' gigs around.
We had a New Year's Eve gig once near Times Square.
That was crazy.
¶ But if you wanna try ¶
- [Narrator] With each gig, the band was getting better
and they were working hard to put themselves on the map.
¶ Put you in a trance ¶
¶ Are you sure you wanna dance ¶
- She was on the phone every day.
She was the most aggressive,
you know other people just sorta like, you know,
they try to move their careers along,
but she was super aggressive about it on a daily basis.
Always on the phone trying to get a gig,
trying to get a manager, every day.
Madonna was like having a tiger by the tail.
She was only like 21 or 22 at the time.
(elevator dings)
¶ But don't expect to stack it right ¶
¶ You'll never ever see her cry ¶
- Hey, hey sorry.
You work with that music woman, the August Management.
- August Artists.
I'm her partner, actually.
- Oh, could you please give her this tape?
I'd really love for her to listen to our band.
- (sighs) She's really busy right now.
I'm not sure she's gonna have time,
but I'll try to give it a listen.
- Well, we're really good.
Our name is Emmy, and I think that if you just
listen to the tape you would agree.
¶ She's a little heartbreaker ¶
- Yeah, I can do it.
- [Dan] Mm.
- I stuck my finger in it,
(Dan groans) and I got burned.
- Oh, yeah.
- Did you ever get burned?
- Not yet, no, but I bet you it'll feel familiar.
- That's a lie.
You've gotten burned.
Even Joan of Arc could tell you that.
(Dan laughs)
She knows a singed body when she sees one.
- Oh, yeah, I've seen the pictures.
- [Narrator] Madonna found a temporary place to stay,
and was trying to find work, but things were looking bleak.
- There was a very, very cold night.
She was renting a room just around the corner
from The Music Building.
It was like two degrees out,
it was like the coldest day of the winter.
- Hello?
- And the heat in that building
she was renting a room in, it wasn't working.
So, I went over there, and she was like in a fetal position.
- Hey.
- Just really freezing.
(whimpers) "I can't stand this."
- What am I doing here?
I'm not getting anywhere.
What am I gonna do?
- She was so depressed, though.
When she was like, (whimpers)
she was ready to go back to Detroit.
She really was, she was ready to bag
the whole Music Building, the whole music thing.
She was so close to really bailing on the whole thing.
- I think maybe I should call Dan.
(somber guitar music)
- "Go out to the synagogue?
"You think that he," 'cause they'd been split up
for X amount of months.
- It was cold.
I didn't think she felt well and she asked me
if she could come over to the synagogue again.
This is after our breakup and of course
I said, yeah, okay.
- He was probably heartbroken when they split up
a little bit, but he didn't hold a grudge.
- [Narrator] Madonna went back to Corona,
back to the synagogue, back to Dan.
(soft rock music)
- So she came over for maybe two days.
We went running in the park as we used to do.
She said, "I feel like I'm going backwards."
Meaning being here in Corona,
but it was a nice little, I don't wanna say
it was like the baby bird returning to the nest again.
It was a fun couple of days, but again,
it brought back that, it was like a breakup again.
How many of these can, ya know?
It was a little like that for me.
So, off she went.
- I think they had a nice healing kind of a thing.
Dan probably helped her stay in the game a little bit,
and I helped to the extent that I could.
I didn't want her to go back to Detroit,
but I could tell she was, it was not happening.
She wanted it to happen now.
- Adam, Adam.
- Listen, you can't keep following me around like this.
You're hounding me. - No, I'm not following you.
Did you give it to her?
- Yeah, I gave her your tape.
She's very busy, like I told you.
Eventually, maybe she'll have a chance,
but not right now. - No.
Not eventually.
- I think Madonna knew that there was this woman
who had a studio on the third floor.
So, I think she wanted her to come see our gig
and maybe sign us up.
- In February of 1981, Adam's partner, Camille Barbone,
was finally convinced to check out the band's performance
at Max's Kansas City.
(audience chattering)
- I had worked very hard (chuckles)
to get us a gig at Max's Kansas City.
That was a hard place to get a gig at in 1980, '81,
but I also sensed something and I was saying,
Madonna, I don't wanna rehearse for a month
and do this Max's Kansas City gig
if we're just gonna split up the next day,
I remember saying.
No, no, no.
- So, I went to see Emmy with Steve Bray and Gary.
It was interesting, because you could see
this gradual shift in direction,
that it was becoming more about her.
(upbeat punk rock music)
- We did the gig at Max's.
She was great, she was like crazy.
She was walkin' out on the tables, ya know?
Madonna was like in good form that night.
She was like really, had a good rapport with the band.
She was just like really doing good.
She was good that night.
¶ She's a little love taker ¶
¶ She's a little body shaker ¶
¶ She's a little heartbreaker ¶
¶ Troublemaker, troublemaker, troublemaker ¶
¶ Love taker ¶
¶ Body shaker ¶
¶ Heartbreaker ¶
¶ Troublemaker, troublemaker, troublemaker ¶
- She blew Camille away.
I knew Camille was there.
I was all for it, too.
¶ She keeps it in a fog. ¶
¶ Emmy ¶ ¶ Emmy ¶
¶ You'll never break inside ¶
¶ But if you wanna try ¶
¶ You won't make it out alive ¶ - But
Camille didn't want the band.
¶ She'll slay you with a glance ¶
¶ She'll put you in a trance ¶
¶ Are you sure you wanna dance ¶
- So, the next morning, I'm just like in our rehearsal room.
These two guys come in and say, "Did you hear?"
¶ She wants to know that you want hers ¶
- Your band is breaking up.
¶ She wants to know that you want hers ¶
- [Gary] So I never even got it from the horse's mouth.
(audience cheering)
- Madonna later told me that Camille
had offered to manage her that night.
- I tried to play it cool like, yeah, whatever, ya know?
I felt bad about it.
(somber music)
I had laid it out there.
I don't wanna rehearse for the next month
if we're just gonna split the next day.
When that happens, it kind of pisses you off.
- Hey.
Madonna!
So, that's it?
You did exactly what you said you wouldn't do.
Oh no, I'm not gonna drop the band.
Well, this could be good for all of us.
No, no, Madonna.
You can't just ignore me, okay?
This is wrong.
- Gary!
What do you want me to do?
- She just turned and walked away.
I made her very uncomfortable.
(fist banging)
- This isn't over, Madonna.
You can't just do whatever you want.
- You could tell she was embarrassed about it,
but she had to do what she had to do.
- Please open the door.
- It was very embarrassing, actually,
when I think back on it.
It was like, let it go, Gary, let it go. (laughs)
- It was this guy, you know?
- Yeah.
- I said, you do it.
I'm gonna be sick.
So, I walked out.
- Yeah.
- Well, the next day I came back.
- You threw up
on the guy. - No. (chuckles)
No, but he had saved one part of the rat
for me to scalp.
Guess what it was?
- I can guess.
- They were all bloaty.
It was icky.
I don't mean to be talkin' about these things,
but it's reality, ya know?
Reality's gotta be talked about.
- [Narrator] In March of 1981, Camille and Adam
signed Madonna to their management company.
Madonna immediately began working
on new music, ready to present herself
for the first time as a solo artist.
Using her industry contacts,
Camille began showcasing Madonna in nightclubs
around New York and Long Island.
One of those clubs was called U.S. Blues.
Camille hired photographer George DuBose
to capture this performance on film.
Her look was becoming more stylized
as she developed her new singular onstage persona.
Camille had also arranged for Madonna
to record a demo tape of some new songs.
The tape included songs like Love On The Run,
High Society, and Get Up.
¶ Get up ¶
(crowd member whistles) (crowd cheering)
(dark electronic music)
- [Narrator] Madonna was flourishing as an artist,
but the relationship between she and Camille
took a bad turn, and Madonna no longer wanted Camille
to be her manager.
- And the rest of the breakups that happened,
she had to go off on her own.
That was just the way it was.
(upbeat synthesizer music)
- [Narrator] No longer having a band,
and no longer having management support,
all that Madonna had was a demo tape
that she recorded with Stephen Bray,
which included a song called Everybody.
Madonna began bringing that demo tape
around to the dance clubs in New York
hoping to get a deejay to play it,
places like Danceteria and deejays like Freddy Bastone.
- I encountered Madonna
21st Street, Danceteria.
She was trying to get a record deal.
The deejays that were playing on the weekend were myself,
Mark Kamins, and it didn't even have to do
with the weekends.
She was coming, you know, seven nights a week,
Danceteria was open.
She was there seven nights a week,
and she was peddling her wares, so to speak.
(rhythmic dance music)
(hand tapping)
I wasn't interested.
I know I look foolish saying that,
but it's the truth, and I'm not gonna say
I thought she was gonna be a genius, 'cause I didn't.
It wasn't my cup of tea.
I'd be stupid saying this now, but I probably,
if it came by me again, knowing what I know now,
I'd sign it, but if I didn't know,
I'd probably still say no way.
This is just like pop dance stuff.
The main deejay who took an interest was Mark Kamins.
I didn't take an interest.
He was one of the most groundbreaking deejays,
and he had the ears and the foresight
to know what was gonna happen with that artist.
He brought it to his company that he was working with
at the time, Sire Records.
- [Narrator] At the helm of Sire Records
was a man named Seymour Stein.
- Mark kind of had a deal with Sire
and Seymour that he would bring in records or acts
and give it to them first.
So, when he got Madonna, he brought it to Seymour,
and Seymour took Madonna on right away.
(upbeat pop music)
- [Narrator] To Stephen Bray's disappointment,
the record deal wasn't likely to happen
unless Mark Kamins produced,
even though Stephen had produced the demo recording.
- They signed her (snaps) as quickly
as you can sign an artist.
I know it was not, they didn't think about it too much.
It was like they got Mark into the studio,
and they did Everybody.
Actually, I was invited to the studio.
I believe it was Blank Tape Studio.
I never went.
I wish I did (chuckles) so I can say I was there!
But no, I never was there.
It was because he said, "I'm doin' Madonna.
"You know, that girl that keeps on bothering us?
"We're signing her."
So, like a fool throughout this story,
Freddy the fool for Madonna, I did not go,
because I did not believe in the project.
- [Narrator] In October of 1982, Sire Records released
Madonna's very first single, Everybody.
- Sire Records, you gotta hand it to them.
They went after it.
- When Everybody came out on Sire,
Steve was really pissed off 'cause Mark Kamins
basically did the exact arrangement of the demo.
- I think Mark's production,
and I know what Stephen's work is, and it's very good.
Stephen is a great writer,
(upbeat dance music)
but Mark's deejaying capabilities and deejaying wizardry,
it was about creating chaos,
and creating a whole vibe,
and that's what he did with Madonna.
It was like a funky house New York sound.
Not taking anything away from Stephen.
He's a great producer, great writer,
but I don't think Stephen could have done that
for that first record, and they might have been lost
if they didn't go that direction.
Who knows?
- [Narrator] By November, the song entered
Billboard's Top 100 on the dance charts,
but Madonna knew that she still needed to push hard
to get the song played anywhere and everywhere possible.
- Oh, no, here she comes.
Lock the door! (laughs)
So, my friend Michael would lock the door,
'cause I just did not wanna be bothered.
I didn't want her comin' up to the deejay booth
and standing there until I played it,
because that's what she would do.
She would stand there, give me the cassette,
and if she gave me the cassette,
she wouldn't let me hold it.
Ya know, having somebody standing there is just,
it gets to you.
You just want, you're like, what do you want, already?
So, you're either gonna play it, or you're gonna tell her
I'm not gonna play it, and I would tell her
I'm not gonna play it.
- [Narrator] Mark Kamins was on Madonna's side,
and was also very invested in having this record succeed.
- Because she knew Mark was in her corner at that time, too.
There was the pre-Mark, and then the after Mark.
So, the pre-Mark, I didn't really care.
But then after Mark, I was like, oh no,
I gotta start playin' this now. (grumbles)
That kind of music never got me,
that single solo girl pop star thing.
So, shows you what I know.
- [Narrator] With the help of deejays, record promoters,
and perhaps the biggest promoter,
Madonna herself, the song quickly climbed
as high as number three on the dance charts.
- It was a 24 hour shift.
I was just really, like eight cups of coffee,
feeling like chills and runny, and
¶ Everybody ¶
¶ Uh, uh, eh, eh, eh ¶
¶ Everybody ¶
came on the radio,
(static crackles)
although it was kinda fun, there's Madonna,
it made me think, man, oh what happened?
Ooh.
It was depressing.
- And now, No Entiendes is proud to present
the world premiere of Sire Recording artist Madonna.
(audience cheers)
Now get up and do your thing!
(audience cheers)
- [Narrator] Madonna put together a track act performance,
and took it on the road starting out
at Danceteria. - Go on, girl.
(upbeat electronic music)
- [Audience Member] Woo!
¶ Everybody come on, dance and sing ¶
¶ Everybody get up and do your thing ¶
¶ Everybody come on, dance and sing ¶
¶ Everybody get up and do your thing ¶
- It wasn't a huge hit, Everybody, but it was a hit
in urban areas, in all the major cities in The States.
It was a good dance hit, it wasn't a pop hit.
(rhythmic pop music)
- [Narrator] It was enough of a hit that Sire Records
gave Madonna another single release,
and then finally a full first album.
- I went to see her, and she had a track act going.
She had herself and another female dancer
and two male dancers, and I was really impressed.
She'd really gotten it together.
She saw me in the audience, and she smiled at me,
kind of like cranked it up a little bit
seeing that I was there.
And for some reason, I didn't go backstage.
At that point, I think I was a little intimidated.
To this day, I regret that I didn't go back
and stay and talk to her after that
'cause that was the last time I was anywhere
within 10 feet of her, with 100 feet of her, ya know?
- [Narrator] The release of Madonna's first album
coincided with MTV Music Television
taking over TV sets all over the world.
Music videos like Burning Up, Lucky Star, and Borderline
were making Madonna a household name.
- Ooh, it happened so fast.
After Everybody and Physical Attraction stuff,
those were like club hits.
Borderline was an MTV video in heavy rotation,
and it was on all over the radio, ya know,
that whole Reggie Lucas produced first album,
that was the eponymous album just called Madonna, right?
And she had her whole image together,
the East Village Bohemian thing, but she made it her own.
The bow and the hair and the rubber bracelets
and the BOY TOY buckle and the whole thing.
She'd really branded herself.
That's how smart she is, ya know?
It was a different route, and it was a fresher route
that she took, and so I think that aided,
and then the perfect storm of MTV and Madonna.
The camera loves her, as opposed to me.
The camera hates me, loves Madonna.
And the camera loved her.
I mean, she looked good in those early MTV videos.
So, like, bam!
Rocket to stardom there.
She was a video star.
¶ Video killed the radio star (chuckles) ¶
- [Narrator] For the very first MTV Video Awards Show,
rather than performing one of her current hits,
Madonna shocked viewers with an introduction
to the title track from her yet to be released second album,
Like A Virgin.
(bright pop music)
In November of 1984, Like A Virgin was released,
giving Madonna her first number one single.
- Usually, second albums are cursed, ya know?
It's like that second album, oh my God.
The second year on a football player's career.
It is always weird, the second year,
but her second album was mega.
I mean, I had to play it at the Palladium, Like A Virgin,
I had to play it three times a night.
"Can you play Madonna?"
- [Narrator] Madonna and Stephen Bray
remained on good terms, and she brought him
into the songwriting mix of the Like A Virgin album,
which went on to sell over 20 million copies.
- Steve saw that, ya know, I'm gonna stay with this path.
Even though he was pissed off that Mark Kamins
stole his arrangement, he didn't let it
blow up their relationship.
So, that was smart of him. (laughs)
(dramatic electric guitar music)
- [Narrator] In April 1985,
Madonna began her first major tour,
performing songs from her first two albums.
At this point, she was selling records
at a rate of over 75,000 per day,
and the tour was selling out as quickly
as tickets went on sale.
(upbeat pop music)
- I knew she was gonna make it,
but I didn't know she was gonna make it that big that fast.
So, it did blow my mind, and then as time went on,
she kept on staying at that level of fame,
or rising to a higher level of fame.
¶ Marilyn to Madonna ¶
It's like you're going, I played with that chick.
It's weird.
It's pretty mind blowing.
- [Narrator] She landed a small role
in the film Vision Quest, and then a major role
in the film Desperately Seeking Susan.
She was now well on her way
to becoming a worldwide superstar.
- She wanted it that bad, she's that ambitious.
She was not gonna be stopped.
- [Narrator] All the while, Dan and Ed Gilroy
had continued working on songs
and playing out as a two-man act.
- Dan and Ed Gilroy gave me a tape
of what they had been doing in the last year or so,
I guess it was, and I was playing it
'cause I was gonna rejoin them,
I was gonna go back to playing bass for them and stuff.
Steve heard it.
¶ That took a memory ¶
- He liked it, ya know?
¶ I can't wait, I don't wanna know ¶
- Gary happened to play some of our tape for Steve,
and Steve said, "Oh wow, what's that?"
- So, after Breakfast Club with Madonna broke up,
and then Emmy broke up, we were able to get Steve
to rehearse with us as he had been working with Gary,
and we put together the New Breakfast Club.
(upbeat synthesizer music)
- And Steve and Gary came over here to the synagogue,
and we started doing the songs
that Dan and I had been workin' on.
- Getting Steve in the band was a big deal
because it took us to a really different level musically.
- We kinda became a dance synthesizer driven band
with drum machines, and it was sort of a Steve Bray thing.
- Stephen was really good in rehearsal
because it was like all business.
Let's do it, let's do it again,
let's do it over again, let's do it over again.
Instead of moving to the next song,
let's get this one right.
- [Narrator] Because of Stephen having co-written
several songs on the Like A Virgin album,
the band was able to get their demo tapes
into the hands of major record companies.
- But it was a lot of fun and it was exciting
being courted by A&R people and such.
- The phone rang, it was Irving Azoff from MCA,
and saying I wanna sign you guys.
That was the first I heard.
What a day that was.
- And then Breakfast Club got signed to MCA Records.
- [Narrator] In 1987, Breakfast Club
released their studio album.
- The big record on our thing was Right on Track,
which was a big summer hit.
It went to number like seven on the Billboard Hot 100.
You couldn't go anywhere without hearing it on the radio
or at the beach or something like that.
¶ Gonna make a move that knocks you over ¶
¶ Watch this turn, this one's gonna put you away. ¶
¶ Yeah, but I'm doin' my very best dancin', yeah ¶
¶ Every time you're lookin' the other way ¶
¶ I could move out to the left for awhile ¶
- And we got nominated for a Grammy as Best New Artist.
Madonna was very supportive.
She sent telegrams over here, ya know,
Great F, asterisk, asterisk, asterisk, asterisk,
I-N-G album.
- Did a lot of nice videos on MTV
back when they used to play videos,
and we used to do MTV veejaying, which was fun, too.
(bright electric guitar music)
Hi, we're Dan and Ed.
We're from Breakfast Club.
Steve and Gary aren't here today.
- We miss 'em, to. - We love 'em.
- So, we had a pretty good relationship with MTV,
and we shot like six videos.
One of them was Kiss and Tell, which we shot in L.A.
(upbeat pop music)
¶ La la la la la, oh oh ¶
¶ I'll kiss and tell ¶
¶ And everybody's gonna know ¶
¶ La la la la ¶
- Silverlake, I think is where we shot it,
and Madonna stopped by.
- She did show up for Kiss and Tell.
It was our second video shoot.
- We weren't all that well known,
and Madonna coming to the shoot made an amazing stir.
- Madonna's here, you know, Madonna's...
She was pretty famous by then.
- The whole, the crew, and everybody,
the craft services people,
because Madonna was there. (laughs)
She come up to me, and gave me a big kiss on the mouth,
and everybody, suddenly my cache went way up.
It was like can I get you?
Can I get you?
Suddenly I was like, 'cause Madonna, Madonna.
And people were, can you introduce me to her?
(soft synthesizer music)
- I was a little starstruck about it. (chuckles)
She had made it so big.
I was a little like tongue tied.
She was probably there more to see Steve and Dan,
I figured, or something like that.
- I hadn't seen her in awhile,
and she was huge at that point.
I hadn't seen her since she was not huge,
and the difference was pretty amazing,
the way people responded.
- Remember how all I wanted was for people to notice me?
Now, I find myself just hiding most of the time.
- And it might have been at a point
where she was just bein' hounded,
paparazzi and all of that, but yeah.
"Now, I spend all my time hiding."
¶ The ants play Bingo in your snout ¶
¶ Your eyes cave in, your teeth decay ¶
¶ Don't cry ¶
- Yeah, let's just, ¶ Don't ¶
- It's not serious at all. ¶ Cry ¶
Don't cry, Dan. - No.
- Don't cry. (Dan grunts)
- You said somethin'.
- Do you cry when I cry?
Do you taste your tears?
(soft ambient music)
(audience cheering)
- [Narrator] In 2008 Madonna was inducted
into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.
- I got a phone call from my niece livin' out in L.A.,
said, "Hey, did you hear?
"Madonna was inducted into the Hall of Fame.
"She talked about Uncle Eddie and Uncle Danny."
- It was a surprise that she mentioned me,
like right away, like that was great.
It was wonderful, in fact, and it changed my whole,
in town, the musicians in town were like, did you see that?
Suddenly, again, it's like we were with Madonna.
It's like she threw the spotlight.
- I have always been fortunate to have people around me
who believed in me.
Starting with my ballet teacher, Christopher Flynn,
and then there was Dan Gilroy.
He lived in an abandoned synagogue in Queens
with his brother, Ed.
They played in a band together.
I was sick of being an out of work dancer,
so he taught me how to play guitar.
I wrote my first song in that synagogue.
It was called, ironically, Tell the Truth.
- One, two, three, four.
¶ This is what I'm going to tell you ¶
¶ This is what I'm going to say ¶
¶ It's not very clear, but it's okay ¶
¶ Tell the truth ¶
¶ Tell the truth to me ¶
- I remember that moment so, so vividly.
I remember the hair standing up on the back of my arms,
and I thought to myself, who just wrote that song?
- Ya know, that thing about when you hear something,
and you go wow, is this, and she said this,
when she wrote her first song, Tell the Truth,
right here on this Carlo Robelli guitar,
and right here in this room, she said,
"Oh, what is that?
"Is it me?"
- I felt like I had been possessed by some magic.
(light guitar music)
¶ I don't have far to go now ¶
¶ But it certainly seems so ¶
¶ But you are the end of the line, dear ¶
¶ I really do wanna go ¶
Madonna probably felt like her time here
was really a good time for her, ya know what I mean?
She came in and found that footing
that maybe she was looking for.
Am I gonna be a dancer or this?
She saw songwriters and all this music and instruments,
and so she was able to figure out I wanna be a songwriter.
I wanna put my stuff out there.
I wanna play music, and so, ya know, it had to be.
- There are many talented beautiful girls,
but she had the drive to push it all the way
to make every bit of her talent work and pay off.
- And she's smart, and she's a businesswoman,
and so she wanted it all, and she really did it.
- I mean, I knew that she was gonna make it
with that ambition.
I didn't think she'd be on the cover of Time,
necessarily, two years later, but she was. (laughs)
- She's the one who made it happen for herself.
You can be as male or female as you wanna be,
but you're gonna be your own person,
and I think that's what there is about Madonna
to this day that makes her so powerful.
- She's not some pop star that was molded by Madison Avenue
or the entertainment industry to become famous.
She's someone that was born that way,
and that essence is there until she's gone,
and maybe, who knows, beyond.
- One, two, ah.
(light acoustic guitar music)
¶ I see you and me on a boat ¶
¶ Or a raft or something that will float ¶
¶ And we're drifting ¶
¶ Little breeze, the gentle swell ¶
¶ Otherwise how can we tell if we're drifting ¶
¶ And if we don't know ¶
¶ Where we're going to, why should we care ¶
¶ We'll find out when we get there ¶
¶ I've got you ¶
¶ Oh I know no matter where we go ¶
¶ Let's keep drifting ¶
¶ And if they say ¶
¶ You're gonna drift your life away, why do we care ¶
¶ We'll just say hey ¶
¶ I will be there ¶
¶ And if we drift too close to the shore ¶
¶ We could go there ¶
¶ What for ¶
¶ Let's keep drifting ¶
¶ Yeah, let's keep drifting ¶
- Come on, I think we're ready.
- [Madonna] Okay, bye.
- I'll give you an extension cord.
- [Interviewer] If she walked in the room right now,
what would you say to her?
- If she walked in the room right now?
It would be quite fun, I'm sure.
I'm sure she'd go hey, hey, and I'd give her a hug,
a long, long, long hug.
That's what I'd do, and it would be fun.
No doubt. (chuckles)
- [Interviewer] That's a wrap!
(men laugh)
- [Singer] One, two, three, four.
(upbeat rock music)
¶ I don't have far to go now ¶
¶ But it certainly seems so ¶
¶ With you at the end of the line, dear ¶
¶ I really do wanna go ¶
¶ But this wind it keeps whippin' in on me ¶
¶ Yeah ¶
¶ The cold wind it keeps whippin' in on me ¶
¶ Oh, yeah ¶
¶ Sometimes my spirit's empty ¶
¶ And I need to fill it up ¶
¶ I know that there is plenty ¶
¶ But I never get enough ¶
¶ 'Cause this wind that keeps whippin' in on me ¶
¶ Ooh, ooh, ooh ¶
¶ The cold wind it keeps whippin' in on me ¶
¶ Oh yeah ¶
¶ Sometimes I try to attack it ¶
¶ It just blows me away ¶
¶ Sometimes I try to attract it ¶
¶ It just blows me down ¶
¶ 'Cause this wind it keeps whippin' in on me ¶
¶ Yeah ¶
¶ The cold wind it keeps whippin' in on me ¶
¶ Oh, yeah ¶
¶ It keeps whippin' ¶
¶ It keeps whippin' in on me ¶
¶ It keeps whippin', whippin', whippin', whippin', whippin' ¶
¶ In on me ¶